ByondNews - Issue 3
Going beyond the BYOND and back again.
3D Effects in a 2D Design
I have been thinking of 3 ways to do 3D effects in a 2D designed game. First would be a 1st person view. Were it has the effect of you looking from your characters eyes and you can see the sky along with the trees that stick up high in the ground.
First Person View
You would need to set up the map in a view system so the grass would be updated with every move along with every pixel. With some cload shadow effects and tree effects. This might be a pretty cool 3D effect in a 2D design. But It is most likely to take on lag.
The second which I havent looked at much is the IsoMetric View. Were they go to a directional giving it kinda of a 3D effect.
The third which I have been studing is the OverHead View.
OverHead View
Is tilted at a slight angle but still looking down. Kinda like the iso but not curved to the right or left. OVERHEAD VIEW WHAT KINDA 3D EFFECT DOES THAT HAVE!? Well first the icons would be made and rendered in a 3d engine and you could give shadow if needed.
What I was really planing on doing how ever is a 3D effect of rotration. Using the map dir proc to rotate the map. Maybe I could change the icons of the view so it lookes like the world is turning. And instead of having 90 and 45 for each angle have flags for every 15 degrees. Then just move have diffrent icons for the ones around you.
Now how would u do this exactly. Turning the world so your looking North but if it was set to north you would be looking east. So it gives the 3D Effect of you living in a 3D world when really its just 2D images looking 3D with cool effects.
So any feedback would be nice. Especially on how I would use the world.dir to turn the icons but still keep me north. Or would I have to turn and some how make a 3D turning effect that way?
I just hope you got some info out of this artical.
ID:265212
 Apr 1 2003, 11:51 am
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Yep, your late :P As soon as I put up my 3D maze, even a bunch of people who didn't download it's source, were able to figure out how to do it and made their own.
Of course OFD was my inspiration with his still non-outclassed 3D maze he made quite a long time ago. :P | |
'3D' in a two dimensional design is something that needs to be talked about and discussed alot more! I think if people really work at it, there may be a few pretty good first person shooters here in BYOND.
I released the source code to my 3D maze, hoping to bring forth a new breed of BYOND gaming. Granted, it needs alot of work to get turned into something REALLY nice, but it's basically a pretty good engine to base a game off of. Dracimor is the only person I know of (so far) to actually take this into interest. He's currently trying to make something out of it, and hopefully he'll get somewhere. The main point being: I think people should really get into this 3D stuff, and see what they can do -- really push their limits. ~>Volte | |
The main point being: I think people should really get into this 3D stuff, and see what they can do -- really push their limits. I never really lke the old style 3D stuff like in the old Ultima games. It was too easy to get lost since it was hard to differentiate areas and if the game provided a minimap I'd just be staring at that the whole game which defeated the purpose of the psuedo 3D :P. | |
Volte wrote:
You're a bit late. ;) Actually if u go back and read thats not even close to what I was talking about. The main subject was how to change the view with world.dir and use flags for new angles. And take those effects and add them to make an overhead view for say an RPG and make it look more 3d by turning it and changing the light source of objects. I hope you get it now and thats the kind of feed back I want. :) of course it was nice to give feedback on the 1st person View. | |
Kunark wrote:
Of course OFD was my inspiration with his still non-outclassed 3D maze he made quite a long time ago. :P I wouldn't have been able to make it without the help of Kaos Advokit, yea, remember that thread =P | |
Theodis wrote:
I never really lke the old style 3D stuff like in the old Ultima games. It was too easy to get lost since it was hard to differentiate areas... Then make a raycaster, oh wait, I think you are =P | |
Then make a raycaster, oh wait, I think you are =P Yeah it's pretty much done except some the rays going in some angles don't work quite right yet since I'm not doing a ray step like you I have to divide my raycaster into 4 directions. | |
I don't think that rotating the world around you makes it any more 3D. It might make it a little more first person, but really what it does most is confuse people and make it hard to draw graphics for. That's why no one uses it.
Unless you've got true 3D capabilities, those 3D mazes are probably the closest you're going to get, besides 3D-rendered graphics. | |
Foomer wrote:
I don't think that rotating the world around you makes it any more 3D. It might make it a little more first person, but really what it does most is confuse people and make it hard to draw graphics for. That's why no one uses it.Make it more first person how so? and why wouldnt the turning of the world make it appear more 3D. This way you could get the width of diffrent views of the world and realise that every think on your screen is not all flat. Unless you've got true 3D capabilities, those 3D mazes are probably the closest you're going to get, besides 3D-rendered graphics. | |
You know a few points. If you can come up with a way to do real time pixel plotting and drawing lines, fills. And then use in game icon scaling you might get to a early Castle Wolfenstien type look.
LJR | |
Ya whiny young wipper snappers! :P
Why... I remember back in tha day.. you had Sierra's "King's Quest".. or "Space Quest" and everything darn thing was a side scrolling game. Also it was so hard at time finding the right point. But you know with some clever overlays, someone could do a 3D game like that where the room is static and the characters move around inside of it. And you have overlays to show the depth. If the character moves up they are going into the frame, if they move down, then they will be coming out of the frame. Anyone experimented with this type system here on BYOND?? Would be great for story telling first person type games. LJR | |
You know a few points. If you can come up with a way to do real time pixel plotting and drawing lines, fills. And then use in game icon scaling you might get to a early Castle Wolfenstien type look. OFD already did this http://games.byond.com/hub/OneFishDown/Maze I'm currently working on a better one that does it more properly though :). | |
Theodis wrote:
You know a few points. If you can come up with a way to do real time pixel plotting and drawing lines, fills. And then use in game icon scaling you might get to a early Castle Wolfenstien type look. Nice.. I've taken a leave of absence from BYOND.. its nice to see new faces pushing the boundry ;) Will check this out when I get home from work. LJR | |
Theodis wrote:
I'm currently working on a better one that does it more properly though :). As a consolation for when your "more proper" one comes out, mine only took three hours to make. I can't wait for your's to come out. However, at least in this version of BYOND, much more than what mine does seems impractical. Anything involving sprites would require scaling, which would probably be a pain without built-in scaling features. | |
As a consolation for when your "more proper" one comes out, mine only took three hours to make. I can't wait for your's to come out. However, at least in this version of BYOND, much more than what mine does seems impractical. Anything involving sprites would require scaling, which would probably be a pain without built-in scaling features. I don't know about your BYOND one, but the raycaster in your java program made some pretty big mistakes. You assumed that the angle between each pixel column was equal. This is true but only if you're monitor is a sphere. There were some other places that you made some bad assumptions too but the spherical projection one is the biggest one that comes to my mind at the moment. | |
http://games.byond.com/hub/Kunark/3DMaze
http://games.byond.com/hub/Jotdaniel/jots3dmaze
http://developer.byond.com/hub/Volte/Voltes3DMazeSource
http://games.byond.com/hub/OneFishDown/Maze
http://developer.byond.com/hub/Leftley/FirstPerson
You get the idea. :)
~>Volte