I just set up a hamachi network for byond players.
Name: BYOND Dev
Pass: 123321
If you dont know what Hamachi is, visit
http://www.hamachi.cc
ID:184169
 Dec 12 2006, 4:08 am
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Drakiel wrote:
lesson. nubs dont use hamachi. This has nothing to do with someone being a newbie. I don't use Hamachi, because I don't like the idea of having my computer so exposed. Right now I've got a few ports open. I know which ones are open, and I'm protected sufficently that no-one can break in. I'm not going to sit there in Hamachi just begging to get attacked by some script kiddie. Not that there are any chances of that. This IS the BYOND community we're talking about here. | |
Android Data wrote:
Been there, done that. Hamachi is useless for any real use. It has many, many real uses outside of Byond. I can use my laptop from any ware in the world and connect to my home network for example. Hamachi is just a very easy to use VPN solution. It is not made for gaming, however it helps a lot for private LAN gaming. As it can Connect LAN segments via a single Hamachi computer on each LAN. I use it for family tech support and my private file server.
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Xzar wrote:
It has many, many real uses outside of Byond. I can use my laptop from any ware in the world and connect to my home network for example. Forward a few ports, and you can do exactly the same thing from literally any computer connected to the internet and you'd be more secure since only a few ports are exposed as opposed to all of them. Your argument is wrong, by the way. You can't connect to it from anywhere in the world, because you're forgetting a) places where there are no computers or no computers with an internet connection and b) computers you don't control and thus don't have the Hamachi software installed. For b you may be able to use your remote control software (for example the only thing I need to remote control is a single file called "vncviewer.exe" and a Windows operating system) wheras installing Hamachi would be impossible (it needs to install it's own drivers and fake a new hardware). Though I do agree that technically b doesn't count: if even a script kiddie at my school can break Windows 2000's security by changing the administrators' password (possibly by gaining access to the NTFS partition and changing some files around) I don't see how difficult it would be to get Hamachi installed. Hamachi is just a very easy to use VPN solution. It is not made for gaming, however it helps a lot for private LAN gaming. As it can Connect LAN segments via a single Hamachi computer on each LAN. Hamachi is not a true LAN. It's just a very very cheap way of getting people's money (if they ever need to get a larger group than 16 people) and having them depend on Hamachi to work, since those people are either too stupid or not allowed to setup their routers/firewalls properly. It's not *that* hard to filter only certain IPs from accessing a port, you know. Hamachi can Block vulnerable Microsoft Windows services while completely ignoring any other ports opened and providing no real protection against that. With Hamachi in use, trojans can finally report back to their masters properly again. hooray for Hamachi! all that's needed is a trojan designed to work for Hamachi and broadcasting any passwords it can deceipher. | |
Forward a few ports, and you can do exactly the same thing from literally any computer connected to the internet and you'd be more secure since only a few ports are exposed as opposed to all of them. You logic is flawed. Port Forwarding will expose Ports to the World, and allow anyone to use them, While VPN by Nature Only Allows Authorized Computers to connect and exposes no ports. Hamachi creates a Secure VPN; information only goes through a direct point to point tunnel. The Direct point to point tunnel uses AES-256 encryption. Your argument is wrong, by the way. You can't connect to it from anywhere in the world, because you're forgetting a) places where there are no computers or no computers with an internet connection and b) computers you don't control and thus don't have the Hamachi software installed. For b you may be able to use your remote control software (for example the only thing I need to remote control is a single file called "vncviewer.exe" and a Windows operating system) wheras installing Hamachi would be impossible (it needs to install it's own drivers and fake a new hardware). Your two points are completely moot as per my example. And I quote “I can use my laptop from any ware in the world and connect to my home network for example.” Either way I hope you never use vnc viewer the way you described. As anything you do is open in plain text for anyone to see. Unless you go through a SSH or VPN tunnel, like the one Hamachi creates. Hamachi is not a true LAN. It's just a very very cheap way of getting people's money (if they ever need to get a larger group than 16 people) and having them depend on Hamachi to work, since those people are either too stupid or not allowed to setup their routers/firewalls properly. It's not *that* hard to filter only certain IPs from accessing a port, you know. Hamachi does create a true point to point tunnel that is encrypted, Oh, and while filtering only certain IPs from accessing a port is good (with limits) anyone in between can see what you are doing. *filtering IPs should be used with SHH and VPN, as an extra layer of security. Hamachi can Block vulnerable Microsoft Windows services Hamachi crates a real network connection between two computers, The firewalls would be up for the internet end on both computers.However If you got a trojan, No hardware firewill in the world is going to stop it from reporting back. | |
Xzar wrote a bunch of logical text about VPN:
You logic is flawed. Port Forwarding will expose Ports to the World, and allow anyone to use them, While VPN by Nature Only Allows Authorized Computers to connect and exposes no ports. Ah, I see. Alright, I drop that portion of my case. Hamachi would be good for communication between trusted clients. My point about Hamachi w/ BYOND still stands: Hamachi is NOT good for BYONDers to use among eachother, because you don't know who is who (and more importantly: the password is on a public forum accessible by anyone on the planet and is indexed by Google as well!). As for the bit about trojans: a firewall would be able to stop it from reporting back if it's configured to be as strict as possible. Although this will destroy the ability to work productively because you have to reconfigure the damn thing everytime you update a program, it'd still block your trojan from calling home. My point about Hamachi is basically the public servers and possible "Hamachi trojans" which may abuse local knowledge to obtain the password to a Hamachi group/room: they would report back to their masters with the group name + password they could connect to, and after connecting will allow them to control your computer since all ports are exposed within the field. A firewall would help, yes, but nobody thinks of that anymore! It's Hamachi! | |
- The main reason for this is the limit put on maximum users. I think it's ±10 but I may be mistaken. Whatever the value, at the time I found it too low and I'll trust myself. A limit of about 10 players is simply too low, espessially if you don't do it server-by-server.
- Another reason is authorization. Some players might not have administrator access and cannot install Hamachi. Some might not be allowed to install Hamachi. Either case, you're alienating those players.
- And there's also the issue about security. "File And Printer Sharing" is on by default on machines running Windows. Running Hamachi will bypass the router protecting the computers' of users, allowing anyone who gets into Hamachi as well to perhaps be able to steal files due to security holes left unfixed. You could argue that they're not supposed to exist at all, but some defaults remain defaults. Most PCs are insecure and are only protected by the routers that connect them to the internet.
If you're really interested in hosting your game, just port-forward your router and setup your firewall to allow you to do so. If you're not allowed, then that's your problem. I'd complain about it. If you have money, you may be able to get your game hosted. Maybe that would work?