Anyone else think L4D2 will be a complete, content-less, ripoff like the first one?
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/L4D2boycott Apparently so.
Valve somehow thinks that since the first one was a big seller; the 2nd one will be too (which is why they've devoted a major budget to advertising it), but I can't remember talking to a single person who didn't regret paying 50 dollars for 4 hours of repeatable game-play. The main reason I got it was for custom content, which is practically impossible (even now that the SDK has been released) due to how the server system is setup.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQWylFmqnwM if you ask me valve needs to just stop making games and focus on steam. They spend years longer than most companies just working on the original release of games, which are half-assed at best, and nowhere near being a "finished" product. Even after several years of updates and patches for most of their games they still seem to be lacking any major content, and feel very unfinished and unpolished.
ID:181920
 Jun 9 2009, 2:17 pm
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I believe they realized their flaw in releasing L4D without enough maps and that will be addressed in the new game.
I really think (hope) they aren't stupid enough to try that bull[dung] again, but on that note I have worked with their customer support before (running a LAN center, we used Steam 4 Cafes) and they are absolutely beyond horrid. So meh. I dunno. <font color="red">Note from moderator: Please refrain from swearing on the forums. Thanks!</font> | |
L4D is one of my favorite games, calling it incomplete ripoff when I paid only like 20 bucks for it is just retarded.
Ill buy L4D2 as well, stop being so picky. | |
Didn't this thread have content in it yesterday. What happened to the opinionated posts about Valve's greedy/innovative games? Where is all the bickering and fun-to-read, would-be flaming?
Also, I do think that L4D2 is a total cop out. I also believe that your statement about Valve's games being half-assed is a bit half-assed in observation. Half-Life and Half-Life 2 were and still are some of the best FPS games around and definitely carry the most immersive FPS story. Portal is one of the most innovative puzzle games that spawned its own thought process; "think with portals." Team Fortress 2 has one of the biggest player bases I ahve seen for a PC game and has spawned numerous memes, gags, videos, side stories, and other stupid crap (meant in a good way). Left 4 Dead was one of the best times I have ever had playing online. L4D2 should be salvaged and scrapped for L4D content. | |
Hiro the Dragon King wrote:
Didn't this thread have content in it yesterday. What happened to the opinionated posts about Valve's greedy/innovative games? Where is all the bickering and fun-to-read, would-be flaming?Mods probably deleted it all, or possibly deleted the whole post and Falacy (being the persistent *@#&*$ @$*&@# he is) just posted it again | |
People are mad because L4D2 is apparently going to be the same game with a couple changes, and it's going to rip the community in two. People will be forced to pay for a completely new game just to keep playing (L4D will be made obsolete).
I'm not completely knowledgable on the matter, but the argument is that the changes don't seem to be major enough to warrant a new game. Most people are saying the things they added could have been added as simply extra content for L4D instead of just creating a separate game. I'm not going to pretend to understand why or why they would or wouldn't do this, but the community (the people avidly playing L4D) do not seem happy at all. L4D hasn't been out for long at all (not even a year to this day) and they're already releasing a sequel that will probably sport for around 40 or 50 bucks. | |
Geldonyetich wrote:
Nah, Valve generally makes very good games - Half-Life, Half-Life 2, Portal, Team Fortress 2 - these guys make games so pivotal to the mainstream gamer PC platform that damning them is like damning the platform itself. The games themselves are usually fun to play and innovative, but most of them can be completely experienced in 4 or less hours. Granted most of them are designed for re-playability, but it still gets boring running around with the same few weapons/items, on the same few maps, even if things on it are always changing around. Masterdan wrote: L4D is one of my favorite games, calling it incomplete ripoff when I paid only like 20 bucks for it is just retarded. How'd you manage that o.O I haven't seen it drop below $40 (which is its current price) even on steam. It may be possible to call the game "complete", but that complete version lacks any notable content. They also extremely screwed up the server system on it, making it difficult to play with friends, and near impossible to find custom content. | |
I can attest to the utter /fail/ that is the L4D server system. If you think it's bad where you live, try it in Australia. It's pretty much impossible to connect to any server - not even US servers with >200 ping at best. Despite the fact that there are definitely servers present.
I don't actually think lack of content is the game's biggest issue. It's not quite as replayable as TF2, but it's still pretty good on that front. The server screwups make it moot, though, because every time I try to play Versus with a bunch of friends it takes half an hour to get on a server (And we normally just end up quick-joining a versus server and ganging up to kick off everyone who isn't in our group via the vote-to-kick option.) | |
Have you tried changing sv_search_max_ping (I think... autocomplete should pop up at sv_search) to something higher? The default is 150 I believe, and so if your continents's allocation of L4D servers has been replaced by deadly animals, it may be preventing you from finding ANY servers.
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How'd you manage that o.O I haven't seen it drop below $40 (which is its current price) even on steam.It may be possible to call the game "complete", but that complete version lacks any notable content. They also extremely screwed up the server system on it, making it difficult to play with friends, and near impossible to find custom content. Valve often does weekend sales for their games. Just recently for the Sniper/Spy update on TF2 I believe they put the game on sale during the free weekend for 10 dollars. | |
Maggeh wrote:
Valve often does weekend sales for their games. Just recently for the Sniper/Spy update on TF2 I believe they put the game on sale during the free weekend for 10 dollars. Yup, I usually buy whatever they have on sale (got the penumbra series last weekend =P), I've never seen L4D on the sale list though. | |
Im simply not so critical. L4D2 was just announced, but the brevity of the changes hasnt been revealed. So far we know the zombie ragdoll physics is different, as is the dismemberment and gore, there are new zombie types, at least one new game mode, 5 new campaigns(thats huge!) and more cohesive story and of course new weapons.
Honestly, I would be happy if they addressed the critisisms by simply giving owners of L4D1 a 50% discount, made sure that the gameplay of the new left 4 dead is good enough to warrant calling it a sequel and then be on their way. Honestly people do get mad when a new game doesnt use a completly different engine, but for left4dead I feel campaigns and other content are all that really needs to be added, you dont need to give it a new physics engine, the game is simple in concept but awesome in execution, still the left4dead 1 campaigns are so much fun that I bet people will still play it. | |
I have not, but there have been circumstances where we know for a fact there was an Australian server available that was completely free and was running at a ping of <100ish, because we could see it in the manual server browser (But logging into it directly and trying to return to lobby did very strange things).
I should probably increase that, though, because 100 is a good ping for me. Thanks for mentioning it. | |
They're also adding everything they couldn't in the original game, which is actually the reason they decided to make a sequel. The amount of changes they're doing would not work at all like something similiar to TF2's incremental updates with the class packs.
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Granted, I live in America with fantastic broadband, but I've never had a problem playing L4D. Either I automatically connected, or I hosted my own(which is dead simple in L4D). The different server model is trying to target what people have come to expect from console FPS. One of the reasons they went after this model is because of the low player count and the more "single player" nature of the game. I think it would have been very hard to wade through 7 million servers to find the one with an open slot, then join before someone else did.
I guess I just didn't have the same experience you did, so I didn't come to loath it. | |
Falacy wrote:
but I can't remember talking to a single person who didn't regret paying 50 dollars for 4 hours of repeatable game-play. I paid $79 or $88 AUD for it last November or December on 360 and didn't regret it. I didn't play it online either, so according to most people I missed out on the largest majority of the game. My lack of caring could have something to do with how little I play most games though. But I will say that I'm not overly excited by the announcement of the second after Valve said there would be more content added later on but failed to do so far (excluding the survival mode DLC, of course). Falacy wrote: How'd you manage that o.O I haven't seen it drop below $40 (which is its current price) even on steam. He probably bought it on the same weekend I got it for PC.  | |
Smoko wrote:
I didn't play it online either, so according to most people I missed out on the largest majority of the game. The online and offline modes are exactly the same; except with players controlling your AI buddies (in most cases the AI are more useful and less friendly firey =P). | |
It sucks that Valve hasnt invested in adequate servers for Australia. I can attest that in Canada the matchmaking system works flawlessly, fast and without lag.
Once they get adequate global server capital I'm sure the problem would be resolved, therefor its not really an issue with the game itself. | |
In my experience they've got better skills, in the sense that they'll never friendly fire, rarely if ever trip things like car alarms, are omniscient, and aim incredibly well. On the flipside, they've got a tendency to do really stupid stuff (Like trying to save you from a smoker by running up to you and meleeing you when they could have just shot the tongue. Or the smoker.), no grenades, they only follow, never lead, it's hard to herd them into defensible positions and get them to stay there, they're useless at dealing with the tank, and they've got a tendency to get a little stuck in some areas (No Mercy, right before the safe house, for example. They keep trying to jump through the window until they get through)
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They're just pulling a rather greedy move with this L4D thing. We didn't shell out $50 for short game whose sequel comes out less than a year later. Consequently, L4D2 is $20 expansion pack stuff, not full second $50 game stuff.
If anything, Valve's problem is that they might be a little too successful. They're thinking to themselves, "well, if we can pioneer the ideas of first person shooter storytelling narrative and secure game portals, maybe we can pioneer the idea behind charging people $50 a year for a quarter of their game." No, that later move isn't pioneering, it's testing the patience of your fan base.