Feb 25 2015, 3:39 pm
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EnigmaticGallivanter
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I tried to use BYONDs features and software recently, however I don't feel so inclined to change what OS I use, and I won't use a VM.
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EnigmaticGallivanter wrote:
I tried to use BYONDs features and software recently, however I don't feel so inclined to change what OS I use, and I won't use a VM. That's not BYONDs fault, that's yours. | |
I didn't read your post beyond no one was using the features, so based from your response I assume that post might have been about things that were BYOND's fault. Or maybe it was about user fault, which I love to perpetuate.
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I tried to use BYONDs features and software recently, however I don't feel so inclined to change what OS I use, and I won't use a VM. I don't see how's it's BYOND's fault that your OS can't run the software or features without a VM. BYOND.exe, DreamSeeker and DreamDaemon/DreamMaker GUI's are Windows only that's clearly stated here - http://www.byond.com/download/ Development/hosting platform only: cannot be used to play games. The Webclient is in BETA so obviously that'll have issues on specific browsers. So whats your issue with BYOND apart from the fact it won't run on your OS without a VM? | |
I don't have an issue at all. I never said they were issues. I don't understand what is going on here.
You might not understand what I mean, and I mean nothing at all. I don't have a point. My last post was me just saying you must have been posting about faults, because that is the only thing i can think it must have been about for you to reply to me about it not being BYOND's fault. I was never talking about faults. | |
EnigmaticGallivanter wrote:
I don't have an issue at all. I never said they were issues. I don't understand what is going on here. It's your fault that you don't understand, not his. I don't have a point. It's not BYONDs fault that you don't have a point. | |
I'm one of those people quietly plugging away in the background. Always have been, always will be. I don't advertise until I have something worth showing... which is usually never, but hopefully things will be different this time. :p
And yeah, I agree with your post. It kind of seemed like you were disagreeing with me at first, but... I don't know, I feel like you said the same things as me but more eloquently, so I guess not. Maybe I'm just not used to people agreeing with me around here? lol I don't agree that WANO and Doohl are the only people working on a game worth anything though... and honestly, I don't think their game is worth shit, because it's still "just a BYOND game." Their game is called Severed World and their studio is called Pixel Realms, so I'm gonna go ahead and make the assumption that "pixel realms severed world" is the most descriptive Google search you could possibly use. Now, you know what that search finds? A bunch of BYOND links. You know who cares about BYOND? People who know about it already and absolutely no one else. You know what else you get? A link to a forum post asking about interest in a Kickstarter... which means they're basically polling from an existing pool of BYOND users. There is absolutely no social media presence here, no industry connections, no reddit posts, no Screenshot Saturdays, nothing, not even a dev blog hosted somewhere other than BYOND. Now, there's still plenty of time to drum up interest, but if you're looking into a Kickstarter as the first step in your advertising campaign, you're doing it wrong. There are plenty of other great games that are being worked on and are already FINISHED that could be marketed outside of BYOND. We, as developers, need to really step up our game, get out of our comfort zones, and shove BYOND games in peoples' faces. The problem we're facing right now is that BYOND has been a very tight-knit community for years and years and years and years and years, where you couldn't show people that weren't already a part of the community your game because to be completely frank BYOND looked like some sort of adware crap... but since we're still so used to being that tight-knit community that only shares with each other, the software has evolved and the developers haven't. We need to change that dynamic. (P.S. I'm really not trying to take pot-shots at Severed World. The game looks fantastic and Doohl has done an amazing job so far. I wish them all the best and I hope the game does fantastically.) Edit: Wanted to put my foot in my mouth for a bit: I did just find a Severed World Facebook page, but that doesn't seem to come up at all through Google. I had to find it through BYOND. Also, there are a few social media sites talking about it but with very limited exposure. | |
...Haaah. Well, I don't feel like quoting specific things out from your post, and i'm not going to write as if i am someone who needs to defend developers like that of 'pixel realms'... but perhaps before you (and any others) decide to start casting your judgements and critique on how others are 'doing things' and doing them 'wrongly', you sit tight and let whoever is in question come out and tell you when it is they've actually started doing whatever it is you've already decided to shake your heads at them about.
Maaaaaybe then* you can have grounds upon which to, for instance, suggest where people have gone wrong, or in which areas things could have been done better. If nothing else, that way you won't be stuck i dunno *eye-roll* stating things without adequate thought/knowledge on the matter. Anyway, my 'two cents' on what i felt should first be addressed upon reading your post (and generally feel so for any posts like it). Simply put, no intentions to start anything unnecessary up, but i felt convicted to respond to this. __________________________________________________ *Even then, probably best to wait till they(whomever)'ve completely done the whole 'shabang': advertising, presentation of 'completed product', marketing, and themselves called it a jolly good day, before you start jumping up rearing to criticise their methods. ya dig?. | |
Upon further scanning through the particulars again, it doesn't appear to me like i've 'missed the point' with my reply to your post. :/ You might want to pay attention to what i myself was trying to get at with my response, i think if you try, you will see the relevance.
Of course, that is unless you're to correct the delivery of what it was you were mainly trying get across, because right now, looking at what you've written, there's not much else to glean from your post than some assertions and premature critiques (at least as shown in the instance you gave) based on opinion or lacking sufficient understanding of the situation you were observing. Alongside this, i also feel you wrote in a way that can easily foster in the minds of the reader, unnecessary and negative ideas/notions* about byond, or the process of game development in general -though perhaps you may not have intended as much. Sure, you did state a few things in your post that are valid, concerning points like -perhaps wasted- opportunities that have been available for already finished games here on byond, as well as a fair analysis on what might be the issue for a large percentage of the byond community at the moment or in general over the years, however your lead up to said points just didn't go over well at all for me. Just to make clear again though, it is not that your post -nor anything mentioned in it in particular- is deserving of special attention, but anyone's really that i've noticed and felt had the same kind of tones/themes in their approach, i'm sure could easily garner a similar kind of response from me as this. Perhaps -i admit- i could have been more reserved in my tone -not employing so much sarcasm and the like within the first reply, sorry about that. All the same, however, i'd like to make clear that all i'm really trying to do here is address what i feel is a general attitude i see now and again amongst a few people in the community, one that i feel is off the mark. I hope you can understand from where it is i am coming. ___________ *You stated your opinion that you felt a game was 'worth nothing' so to speak because it was "just a byond game" (was quoted by you i know), but what exactly is that supposed to mean? you mentioned the links that come up as search results had 'a bunch' of byond links, and so what? that's because it's a game developed with byond. Look. There's urging people to not sit and confine themselves to a bubble within the byond community, that they should raise awareness, preferably build connections and market from off it... and then there is acting as if every link to byond has to be erased or hidden, almost as if we as developers should treat it like its some kind of stain to be covered up somewhere in a corner, and well for me that, apart from the bitter taste, just strikes me as ungrateful if not selfish. Let me not go into that any further though and just mention that all you need to do is simply scroll down to the second half of the first page to see the first lot of other links** available that one can access related to PR's game, and this is for a project that it seems hasn't yet made it's really definitive/big move in order to establish itself to the wider world... and if they haven't, why should they? Though right now one can have an idea of their future plans, one can also gather that their group don't yet perceive themselves to be where they want to be before unveiling what is behind the curtain a little to the wider audience. This is why i mentioned that for certain comments people tend to like to make -like yours in criticising approach earlier- it'd likely be wiser to wait until we're certain that the person/team has exhausted all attempts to accomplish what they set out to, and have in fact truly failed, before coming in with comments of a nature so post-mortem like that they'd easier effect negatively than positively. | |
I appreciate the shift in tone. :)
I really wasn't trying to be negative at all about Severed World -- I think it looks like a fantastic game and I think, as far as development goes, they're doing everything right. I just think that they already should have started at least a minor amount of PR, especially if they're considering a KickStarter. Another game that comes to mind is Spirit Age -- fantastic artwork, solid idea, but their KickStarter fell flat on its face because it had absolutely zero PR outside of BYOND. I sincerely hope that Pixel Realms intends to prove me wrong by launching a PR campaign before starting their KickStarter, as I'd like nothing more than to see them succeed. And I don't really understand where you got the idea that I think BYOND is a "stain to be covered up somewhere in a corner." Perhaps this is due to poor wording on my part. Obviously a game made with BYOND should have ties with BYOND and the BYOND community, but my main concern is that there isn't enough of an outside focus -- if you were to make a game in Unity, for example, you wouldn't have the majority of your PR focused on the Unity forums. I hope, if they read this at all, the Pixel Realms team doesn't think that I'm trying to nitpick at them or criticize their hard work. I use Severed World as an example because I think it's BYOND's best chance at a commercially viable game at the moment, and I want them to succeed and to set an example for future developers. | |
 I was doing some of my quizzes I so kindly procrastinated on and have them due today... And I came across this. I'm not sure if I posted about this in this thread yet. But, I know for a fact I have been thinking about it. And, I also know that everyone will find it to be very useful. Most engines today do this or are moving towards it because it's one of the biggest time savers. | |
Anyone who wants to write an advanced IDE is more than welcome to. The hard part is the map editor, which has to interact with the object tree (and also has to be drawn, which is a whole other set of hassles).
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Lummox JR wrote:
Anyone who wants to write an advanced IDE is more than welcome to. The hard part is the map editor, which has to interact with the object tree (and also has to be drawn, which is a whole other set of hassles). Y'know. I could probably do something like the click-to-drag coding that was made. Instead, you click and drag screen-objects for a GUI, set anchors, and it generates code for those objects to change their screen pos based on the window size and only updates when the screen is resized. So, on resize, it cycles through all screen objects and rearranges them. Because the current anchoring with North South West Center etc... It doesn't match the same anchoring as actual interface elements. | |