I'm pretty sure it's allowed, but be sure to put up warnings.

XxXAlmasyXxX wrote:

I don't think this goes here.

I heard there’s certain restrictions as to the type of games you can publish, so would a game where you're in prison, with gangs, drugs, language, rape, and an assortment of other crimes be aloud?

Hrm, given that BYOND tries to keep things at least somewhat family friendly, such an entry would likely never be published.

But a larger question is why you would even want to make a game that simulates some the worst aspects of humanity. And not to be snarky, but I wonder if the incorrect spelling of "allowed" in your subject bodes well for such a project....

Your idea is broken.

First of all, if prison life were exciting and interesting enough that gamers wanted to experience it, maximum security would be a recreational facility. The reason that people dread prison is that their normal lives are more interesting.

Secondly, the activities that you suggest would provide the game's entertainment are only fun for the people that participate in them because those people are in prison. They have nowhere else to go. They can't go out and buy Halo or get a real job, so they find a lower standard of entertainment. On BYOND, people can leave your game any time--and they will, since the activities would lose their novelty very quickly and have little entertainment value in the first place. Unless you can find a way to literally imprison your players within your game, they won't dig it.

My third and final point deals with reality. Prison is an excellent example of human reality because prisoners exist in a world where they do not have monetary responsabilities, they do not have responsability to others, and they are not tended to by people who care about them. Without these standards present in free society, the instincts of prisoners are brought to the surface. Gamers play games because those games let them escape their internal realities to find a world more interesting, at least for the moment, than their own. However, by simulating a prison, you are creating an environment that is the opposite of that which gamers look for.

Your idea is broken. Where games are about release, prisons are about confinement.

PirateHead wrote:

Your idea is broken.

First of all, if prison life were exciting and interesting enough that gamers wanted to experience it, maximum security would be a recreational facility. The reason that people dread prison is that their normal lives are more interesting.

Grand Theft Auto San Andreas You live in the ghetto but its one of the top games, and i live in the ghetto, and its more fear than interest

Secondly, the activities that you suggest would provide the game's entertainment are only fun for the people that participate in them because those people are in prison. They have nowhere else to go. They can't go out and buy Halo or get a real job, so they find a lower standard of entertainment. On BYOND, people can leave your game any time--and they will, since the activities would lose their novelty very quickly and have little entertainment value in the first place. Unless you can find a way to literally imprison your players within your game, they won't dig it.

what do you mean about a lower level of entertainment all prisoner do is read almost or play basketball work out ect so they stay active physicly and mentally i dont see how thats a lower level of entertainent than playing a game

if they would lose there entertainment how do rpgs keep people interested all you do is kill things and try to supass everyone else playing so i see not much difference

My third and final point deals with reality. Prison is an excellent example of human reality because prisoners exist in a world where they do not have monetary responsabilities, they do not have responsability to

others,

they have responsiblilty to stay alive and keep there friends alive so they have the greatest responsibilty

and they are not tended to by people who care about them.

if they wanted to be tended to by there mom and dad they would live in there basement inless youre talking about friends with in prison you would have to have them just to survive i dont see your point

Without these standards present in free society, the instincts of prisoners are brought to the surface. Gamers play games because those games let them escape their internal realities to find a world more interesting, at least for the moment, than their own. However, by simulating a prison, you are creating an environment that is the opposite of that which gamers look for.

whats not interesting about a prison in you create weapons just like people find interesting in rpgs you have to use your wit to survive like rts i see nothing more interesting

Your idea is broken. Where games are about release, prisons are about confinement.

Jmurph wrote:

Wow, nice post.

I'd disagree. Wait, I did.

While I am sure some may disagree on the subject,

yep

your post is a succinct and well organized summary

It was written nicely, sure.

of the flaws in the idea.

That I disagree with. I think the flaws were in his summary, and his logic. The game seems promising to me.

~X

Jmurph wrote:

That I disagree with. I think the flaws were in his summary, and his logic. The game seems promising to me.

Ermm, so is it the shivvings or the buggery that fires up your spirits? ;-)

Shiving? There's no such thing a shiv is a weapon what you do with it is shank.

And what's the difference between killing people in a prison game, and killing people, and monster in a fantasy game?

I have no doubt there are players who will be interested in such a game. Hell, I was bored to tears by it, but look how successful the GTA series is (although they focused alot more on wanton destruction than this seems to, and wanton destruction is always a popular release mechanism).

And if he can pull off the "Oz" of video games, that would be impressive. OTOH, "Oz" is alot more about illustrating the brutality and effects of prison than anything....

I suppose I will wait until the game is released to judge it. Who knows, maybe it will have the best prison riots ever! :-)

They put the period (.) on the keyboard for a reason.

Thats not very nice. For no reason, you create a post tending to put him down, after all he has done was create a point.

I don't see the point in doing this. You might as have well just not posted at all.

I say this is the most respect, I was just noting something.

PirateHead wrote:

1) you're in prison
There's some fun in this. You're confined. The game maker must make very good use of the space. However, prisons in general aren't really interesting. The drama is interesting, but high walls and concrete floors don't constitute entertainment in and of themselves.

Neither do endless grass tiles, repetative trees and the same rock over and over again. You're getting too nit-picky about a game you've never even set eyes on, let alone played. Just because Almasy said it was to take place in a prison, does not mean everything you see will be the same two block turfs ad infinitum. This point is invalid, as it pertains to any game anywhere.

2) gangs
Gangs represent groups of prisoners who form groups in order to mutually benefit each other. Because of the prison setting, these form more out of necessity than the need for entertainment. Twisting a gang setting into an entertaining game really warps the underlying cause of the gang culture.

Guilds, then, if you'd like. It doesn't matter what you call them, the setting or how benefitial it is. A gang is simply a group of poeple working together. Again, you seem to think the setting here is somehow negating any fun a person might have.

3) drugs
Drugs are used in prison because they allow change to the tedious throught processes of prison life. However, in-game they represent only objects of wealth. The actual effects of the drugs are lost because of a game's inability to realistically simulate the brain-altering effects they bestow.

I dont know... my firend described a game where he found a mushroom, his character ate it, at which point the screen went all wonky with color, the character wouldn't stop giggling, and would sometimes get all paranoid and hide under a desk. From what I was told, it was pretty realistic for a game. You haven't seen his game, you haven't even asked him about it. You'r labeling his ideas poor and in now way capable of ever being fun just because of the context. You're being prejudice, sir, and it stinks.

4) language
Language is simply an expression of angst or a learned communication behaviour. There isn't entertainment in this unless harsh language is so taboo to you that using it gives you a thrill.

No, here you are wrong. Language is simply a form of communication. In prison, things can be harsh on the sensitive ears, of course, but language is a powerful asset. Information is big business, and keeping that information flowing without the wrong people knowing it is key, hence the slang and jibber-jabber you often hear. It's not swaering to be bad, it's slang to be covert.

5) rape
Rape is the vile sexual domination of another person. This happens in prison because of the power structure created by the confined enviornment. A game featuring entertainment based on rape is not challenging unless the number of rape victims that pleasure you is a function of your prestige in the existing power structure.

Horror is entertaining. Nice idea about pimping for props. Almasy should try something like that. Your main point is, again, off the mark. Rape is about power. It's the ultimate form of pwnage. It's often found throughout the animal kingdom as just that, a way to assert one's dominance over another. In a prison setting, it's often less about sexual release than it is about politics. Some people allow others to rape them for protection.

6) assorted other crimes
Many crimes occur in prison because they represent a rejection of rules, authority, and other things that criminals who have been incarcerated resent. These are not a basis for entertainment. They do not generate wealth or real status for the prisoners. Their gains are pitiful in all ways and are only meaningful within the prison setting.

Many crimes accur in prison because prisons are full of criminals. You don't need a PHD to figure that out! :P The resentment comes from the fact that they got caught and are doing time. Saying crime isn't a bsis for entertainment has to be the biggest heap of bull dung I have read this week. Thanks for ripening up my day. XP

As to the notation that roleplaying games are similar, I believe that it isn't true. Fighting, looting, treasure-hunting, and killing are interesting because they represent a free and adventurous spirit that is supressed in modern culture.

A prisoner working the system, their gang, other gangs and other prisoners in clever and underhanded schemes and plots in a suppresssed modern culture of a prison are also interesting, just not to you. Please stop forcing your personal view of this subject onto others. I, for one, do not agree with it.

A game enviornment created to simulate this provides a good enviornment for roleplay, advancement, and many kinds of entertainment.

Which he's trying to do.

The difference between prison in a game and prison in a movie is the carefully constructed drama the movie presents. A prison roleplaying game would have to rely on drama created by the players. Unless you have a very dedicated group of people with a prison fascination, the drama that fuels popularity of the prison setting in the media is nonexistant.

Again, have you played this game? What are you basing these judgement calls on? Where are your facts? Prison movies are interesting becuase of the drama, yes, but that's not the only thing that makes them interesting. And who says roleplayers need to supply drama? Can't the game maker do that as well? I mean, they are creating the game. Can't the very setting incline people towards this drama? Let him worry about making it fun.

The difference between killing a person in prison and killing a monster in an RPG is that in prison, you'll be caught and punished; in an adventurous game, you are rewarded with glory.

You're rewarded in prison too, by not being the one getting killed. Also, assassins and hit men don't just exist on the street. Every RPG class I can think of I can find direct cooralations to in a prison environment. Saying that just because it is set inside a prison means it will not work as a game is wrong. Stop discouraging him, please!

~X

Well, while I don't really find the idea of the prison game interesting, I would like to add that everyone has a different idea of fun and different likes/dislikes. It's like horror movies. Some people watch them and love it, and others hate the movies because they scare them. We don't really know how well the game will do just based on concept. The programming, graphics, plot and moderation of the game will all determine the popularity of a game. And why should we stop a game like this? After all, people love reality TV shows, and this would basically be an interactive version of one of those.

Not, mind you, that I am particularly condoning the idea of the game. But let's face it, there are many games out there which deal with issues just as horrible (or whatever you want to call it) as those you may expect to see in this game. What makes them different? They are publicly accepted. For all we know, though, this game may be as well. Depending, again, on the aforementioned factors, and also the level of intensity with which they are represented.

In fantasy games, killing monsters is a watered-down way of representing killing people, allowing your enemies to shed all good components and be seen as totally evil. In real life, nobody is totally evil, which adds a moral weight to anything we do to them. Killing people is also quite accepted though (in games on byond), including stuff like gassing them, strangling them and bashing them to death! And no, that wasn't a prison game. But why that game succeeds in pulling that off is that the entire game is not merely focussed on killing (and there is no visible violence). This is my point. The intensity level will attract some and repel others. A totally true depiction may shock people too much and cause the game to be deleted, and a really weak depiction may cause the game to lose its grip on the players and realism. So really, it depends on the producer to pull off the game properly, so as to reach the right audience.

Remember, it is foolish to put down a game just because it mimics real life, since it still happens in reality. Of course, making a game based on something which society frowns upon is different (such as a game based on rape). However, if it is included in the right way, it may be seen as acceptable, and even may help to change society! If he wants to make the game, I say let him. The reaction people have will speak for itself.