ID:152644
 Mar 23 2006, 12:32 am
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OK this is more or less just a poll-type question. Is there anyone else here who thinks BYOND Games should drop the Statpanel() in favor of a HUD. I realize that in some games this could become a major problem (Turn-based Games)However a Single HUD and a Macro Key for a list of Verbs(.m) would present a much cleaner and faster world. Your thoughts please
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It depends on the game. I would rather have well designed stat panels than confusing HUD elements.
One big problem with HUDs is that they tend to reduce visible elements. Depending on the game, this can range from annoying to unplayable. | |
TheLunarWolf wrote:
OK this is more or less just a poll-type question. Is there anyone else here who thinks BYOND Games should drop the Statpanel() in favor of a HUD. I realize that in some games this could become a major problem (Turn-based Games)However a Single HUD and a Macro Key for a list of Verbs(.m) would present a much cleaner and faster world. Your thoughts please i prefer for the HUD to strictly display vital information. any stat that isn't very important but will be changing often would be displayed in a stat panel. other information and commands can be accessed through pop up browser windows. a complicated HUD can take a long time for DS to draw and really slow the game down. | |
OneFishDown wrote:
i prefer for the HUD to strictly display vital information. any stat that isn't very important but will be changing often would be displayed in a stat panel. other information and commands can be accessed through pop up browser windows. a complicated HUD can take a long time for DS to draw and really slow the game down. I understand that a complicated HUD can take long to draw and may use too much memory but a simple 1 or 2 bar HUD can provide a much cleaner world if it is showing the basics such as Health/Exp or Health/Mana. If all verbs are macroed to a single key it can free up space for unlocks/bonuses and improve playability | |
The best way is both ways. Have the option for both and let the players decide which they would prefer to use.
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I find that this style hud normally works best:
_ _ Where both sides are 1 tile tall and the middle is 1/2 or less. The sides can have HP and a second bar stat, commands running across the half bar. This makes almost no points that are invisable to the user while giving plenty of space for information and shortcuts. One of the major issues with huds in simi-action games is that most people don't fix the view window. Most people take up an entire row with the hud and that means that someone can "hide" under your hud, attacking you out of site. | |
Scoobert wrote:
One of the major issues with huds in simi-action games is that most people don't fix the view window. Most people take up an entire row with the hud and that means that someone can "hide" under your hud, attacking you out of site. Couldn't you just place the hud at "1,0 to [world.view*2+1],0"? | |
There are many ways to fix said problem, but most people don't. I am just pointing out a major flaw in most huds I have seen on BYOND.
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Not untill heck freezes over. I would never EVER consider marcos for verbs. if byond made this change I would leave.
I do think that more customization of the statpanel is in order though, basicly if you could re arange it and add buttons and change colors and junk it would be fine. I would, however, consider any other way of useing verbs. | |
Well, I've already adopted this development mindset...
Every game I have out there, and every game I will create in the future will be stat panel free... I really dislike them... But beside my personal tastes, how many other games (non-BYOND, I mean) in existence do you know of that use that sort of interface? Console games have all controls mapped to a select few buttons on a keypad... This is basically a macro system... Each button triggers an assigned function, which then branches into context-specific functions based on game conditions (for instance, the A button can be "Attack" if you're near an enemy, but "Talk" if you're near an NPC) Computer games are a bit more iffy on this, but none that I've ever played used anything resembling the BYOND stat panels... In fact, most of them use a handful of controls that are all mapped to keyboard buttons (lacking a console controller, the keyboard substitutes), or HUD buttons... There's no reason that BYOND games can't use similar setups... There's no reason for a BYOND game to have a hundred verbs cluttered throughout a dozen panels... And in many cases, the controls of a game can be pared down to a very small number... In these cases, a strictly HUD interface is (what I feel) the best way to go... Granted, I generally have a tendency to neglect those that (for whatever demented reason) prefer to use the command line (or set up their own keyboard macros), by not even including verbs at all* in my games (all functions are handled through procs called by HUD buttons, paring control of my games down to nothing but mouse, and arrow keys... or just the mouse if you want to use BYOND's directional pad) But I don't have any plans to change my interface-nazi ways...lol *Well, I've included the communication systems as verbs for command line access (like your usual chatroom), but that's it... | |
SuperSaiyanGokuX wrote:
But beside my personal tastes, how many other games (non-BYOND, I mean) in existence do you know of that use that sort of interface? Tabbed panels to display information? Lots of them. Particuly MMORPGs. It's a nice way to display a bunch of information without putting it all in a huge form. Statpanels are a fairly good system, it's just that they're abused by basic most BYOND Developers to the point where you link statpanels with poorly made/thought-out games. Like you said, you login to a game and encouter a hundred verbs that all do the same thing. The problem is more about bad game design than statpanels themselves being bad. Whether you're using a HUD, statpanels, macros or the browser how good (or bad) they turn out depends on how you use them. | |
DarkView wrote:
SuperSaiyanGokuX wrote: Heh, here's where we're thinking differently... I'm referring to verb panels, not information panels... I can see the usefulness as actual stat panels, but for game control, they're the absolute worst (and it's this application which doesn't see the light of day in most games) But actually, now that I'm thinking about it, any game that needs that many displayed stats is designed poorly, anyways, so they're not even really that worthwhile in those cases... | |
I dislike verbpanels as well, but many BYOND users find them helpful. Certainly I wish I could bring up an easy list like that in the MMORPGs I play. Typing /help and scrolling through 50+ commands in a 10 line textbox is far worse than a verbpanel. That's why I allow players to turn their verbpanels on and off, with the default being off for a cleaner interface.
As for statpanels, I'll never use one again when I can drag-and-drop between the browser and Dream Seeker. I also dislike HUD buttons as an input interface. Clicking a pretty icon is no better than clicking a little green word. The best interface allows players to do things by mouse action and by verb, so they can choose what suits them best. The mouse should only be required when precise positional controls are needed, such as drawing or targetting. | |
Now, personally, I'm a HUGE fan of the HUD. Though, I see HUDs on BYOND are exceptionally poorly programmed, so unless you know what you are doing, don't even try.
As for me, I know what I'm doing, and I use a combination of browser windows, statpanels, and HUD. I think the combination is the best route to go. I use Browser windows for when I need to display something pretty, the statpanels when I need to display a lot of something, or for a short time (more often than not, the contents of a container, or something like that.), and the HUD for information you always need, and is pretty consistent among players. Though, that's all information based. I'm more than a fan, though, of mouse control and macros. I typically modify BYOND's default mouse procedures HEAVILY, so I can distinguish between a click and a doubleclick, then add in a few drag/drop-based commands, and sparingly, I use control-clicks. (A control click is activating a command, then clicking somewhere else.) If I could capture when the player right-clicks something, I'd be so much more in control of my games! I'd also like to add, that the command bar at the bottom is a good tool for more than chat. If you are good at what you are doing, and know game design well enough, well, you'll figure it out. | |
Statpanels are fast, cheap and easy.
HUDs are tougher, take a bit longer, and can ruin/improve the look of a game. (Depends on what and where it is) Also, they can't be used in Text based games... I prefere Statpanels for the all-round abillity. No risk. | |
For my Games, I use 2 Statpanels.
One for information on my character and the Otherone for my Inventory.
The HUD I use for the Verbs that are used the most often in the game.
So in my Eyes, the HUD is just as important as the Statpanels