Poplava Challenge #1

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ID:114119
 
Jun 5 2011, 11:19 am (Edited on Jun 6 2011, 5:33 am)






- Challenge:

    - Create a game which utilizes HEXAGONS in 60 days or less.

- Prize Pool:

    - 1st Place
      - $100.00 (US currency) paid via PayPal or memberships
      - 25000 Resource Center Silver

    - 2nd Place
      - 25000 Resource Center Silver

    - 3rd Place
      - 10000 Resource Center Silver

    - BYOND Member Choice
      - 25000 Resource Center Silver

    - PopLava Choice Award
      - An offer may be extended to one entry where PopLava would offer to act as an investor, contributor, publisher, and promoter. The details of this offer will be provided to the winner of the award. The primary objective would be to organize a significant effort (devs, artists, and other resources) to help drive the game to a polished and published state. If an offer is made and accepted, it will be announced.

    - How Donations Work:
      - Donations will be split evenly among 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and BYOND Member Choice awards. Please send donations to support@poplava.com (PayPal) and specify Donation in the description. Every little bit adds up and helps motivate our devs. If a Poplava Choice Award is offered and the game is published, your name will show up in the game credits as sponsors and I will make every effort to include you in any additional rewards.

- Rules:

    - Must utilize hexagons in the core game play. It can be the primary field of play such as a game board, field, map, and etc. It could be placed hexagon parts which interact with other hex based parts. The hexagons must be utilized as part of the core game play. A background image with hexagons that are not used in the game play does not count. Using pieces shaped as hexagons without any hex based interaction or functionality does not count.
    - The game must be made without using any of the 4.0 interface features which simply means, no interface.dmf file. 
    - All commands and user interface components must be integrated into the map so the verb panel is out.
    - Must be a multi-player game.
    - Has not been released as a finished game. If it was released as a demo, example, or even in a previous competition, it's still eligible. If you have any doubts, ask.
    - Has not taken 1st place in another competition.
    - Use whatever libraries you want
    - Entries MUST BE PROVIDED as .zip/.dmb files before midnight on the deadline date. A link to your share, dropbox, and etc will suffice. I'll host all projects for the BYOND member choice awards.
    - 100% original or legally usable assets (code, sounds, art, images, etc). Submissions with ripped off works are ignored.

- Rules Disclaimer:

    - If there is a gap in the rules that you are not sure about, please ask and I will clarify. I reserve the right to modify or add new rules to the competition to preserve the spirit of the competition (more specifically to avoid cheating!). Don't make the mistake of submitting an entry with a questionable loop-hole in the rules just to have it rejected.

- Other Stuff:

    - Team captains decide how money is distributed.
    - I'm not responsible for ensuring your ability to receive the prizes. If your country doesn't receive Paypal, that is your problem to solve.
    - The official judge is tsfreaks.
    - Source code submissions aren't necessary.
    - Resource Center Silver awards are non-transferable. (i.e. no withdrawing)

- Judging Categories:

    - Fun (1-10)
    - Interface (1-10)
    - Overall Creativity  (1-10)
    - Theme (1-10)
    - Puzzles and Challenges  (1-10)
    - Control (1-10)
    - Level Design (1-10)
    - Potential (1-10)
    - Wow (1-10)

    - Note:  There will be no official scoring on Audio, Glitz, or Polish in order to promote more effort in other categories. Make no mistake, those things can certainly influence a judge even though they are not scored.

- Design Considerations:

- The entire point of the competition is to design for the Flash Client. In short, BYOND can provide multi-player experiences where most Flash games do not. Take for example, the Flash based game Hex Empire. This is a perfect example of where BYOND can do better by providing a multi-player experience. Aside from great looks, Hex Empire is just a casual based clone of Risk style games. Another key aspect of this style of game is the user interface. It's primarily contained within the map.

- Another important thing to keep in mind is that we don't fully understand how players will log into our flash based clients yet. My recommendation is to try and make your log-in logic as decoupled as possible from your core game and interface so it can be swapped out for another system if needed.

- Performance is a critical factor. The more static and event driven your design, the more users you can support per server/game.

- FREE RESOURCES:

- HexSource
- For a limited time, I'm dropping the price to FREE on a hex based map example in the Resource Center to help people get a jump start. Here's the direct link: Hex Map Example

- Timelines:


    - June 6th:
      - Provide time for questions, clarifications, and sponsors.
      - Official Start Date which is based on the Resource Center server time.
      - Genre/Theme announced

    - August 7th:
      - Deadline is at midnight based on the Resource Center server time. You can see the clock in the bottom right corner of the Resource Center.
      - No extensions and no exceptions.

    - August 21st
       - Peoples choice awards complete
       - Judging complete
       - Results published
       - Prizes distributed throughout that week as quickly as possible.

Connect: Resource Center
More: Info

Jun 5 2011, 11:52 am
Interesting. Definitely throwing my hat into the ring.
Jun 5 2011, 12:45 pm
I don't think I'll be able to do this given my current situation :(
Jun 5 2011, 1:51 pm
No interface file? That's just stupid. I would love to try this, but I just can't handle dealing with the default interface. At least allow me to take the ugly garbage out and make it just a map on a window. That's all I'd do anyways.
Jun 5 2011, 2:40 pm
The no interface part is how we provide a flash like experience which is what online gamers have come to expect. Not saying there isn't room for change but, lets get our foot in the door first eh. :)
Jun 5 2011, 4:47 pm
What constitutes multi-player? Do player have to be able to interact with each other, or can something like keeping high scores count?
Jun 5 2011, 5:03 pm
PopLava wrote:
The no interface part is how we provide a flash like experience which is what online gamers have come to expect. Not saying there isn't room for change but, lets get our foot in the door first eh. :)

The Flash experience that online gamers have come to expect does not look like that piece of trash default interface that BYOND has. I'm pretty sure that Tom has talked about making the Flash client use only a map as well, since that's what the vast majority of Flash games have. How hard could it be? They're able to have a specific interface on it right now, I would think it'd be just as easy to get rid of all of it and just put a map. Simple is better... and less hideous.
Jun 5 2011, 6:17 pm
Did you run your theme idea by anyone else? I've come up with more than my share of event killing themes, but "hexagons" will go far to sabotage the goal of showing off what BYOND can do. It's similar to making your theme "pixel movement"; both require that you throw out or heavily modify the core movement, location, and control systems.

I suggest that you provide an alternate theme (or several) that would allow developers to make use of all the core BYOND systems while still making a good game. Or, you could evaluate why you're using a theme in the first place. In the GiaD events, the theme is there to prevent people from submitting projects that were made previous to the start of the event. Your event allows the use of previously developed (but not released) projects, so this isn't an issue. Requiring any theme, especially one so intrusive, may not be in your best interest.
Jun 5 2011, 8:15 pm
@Fugsnarf: Your absolutely right and I commented on it in the previous challenge post. Tom said we would most likely get a map only experience when they release the client. We are presently stuck with the output panel for now but that shouldn't hinder progress. Consider the effort an alpha release until we get our hands on the Flash Client.
Jun 5 2011, 8:21 pm
@National Guardsmen: In the spirit of multi-player, we expect the players to have in-game interactions. :)
Jun 5 2011, 8:47 pm
@IainPeregrine: I spent a lot of time thinking about the Flash-Client and how all various game genres would play out. I truly beleive that hex based games have a strong future with BYOND and the Flash-Client.

"...but "hexagons" will go far to sabotage the goal of showing off what BYOND can do."
- I don't accept this as a fair point. I don't think I ever declared the competition as having a goal of showing off what BYOND can do. I think the primary goal is to produce something that would be well suited for the Flash-Client. Granted, I think we always have the underlying goal of trying to show off what BYOND can do. However, I don't see how multi-player hex games are some how going to "sabotage" peoples opinions of BYOND.

"It's similar to making your theme "pixel movement"; both require that you throw out or heavily modify the core movement, location, and control systems."
- Yup, and in both cases, we get a much more interesting and richer experience for it when compared to traditional BYOND games.

- I truly respect your input and gave it a fair amount of consideration. I'd like to move forward with current requirements. We'll see how it plays out and maybe you'll be able to say "I told you so" when all is said and done.
Jun 5 2011, 9:15 pm (Edited on Jun 5 2011, 9:21 pm)
how 2 make decent hex game without making use of dmf.

FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF


admittedly a game that uses hexagons isn't necessarily a turn based strategy.


oh and a reminder: Don't use my hex library. It works well, but it was designed for the days when world.icon_size was stuck at 32x32.

In other words, my hex library is designed for the days of yore and I haven't had the time to update it (as it would require completely recoding it)
Jun 6 2011, 2:00 am
IainPeregrine wrote:
Or, you could evaluate why you're using a theme in the first place. In the GiaD events, the theme is there to prevent people from submitting projects that were made previous to the start of the event. Your event allows the use of previously developed (but not released) projects, so this isn't an issue. Requiring any theme, especially one so intrusive, may not be in your best interest.

My thoughts exactly. I think you should also consider the purpose of the contest. A contest is a good way to get people to address a shortcoming in BYOND's collection of games (in the case of things like GiaD or GSD, it's to address the general lack of games).

Most current games won't work on the Flash client. A contest could be a good way to get some games ready for the Flash client but it doesn't make sense to have such a restricting theme. BYOND needs games of all types for the Flash client.
Jun 6 2011, 9:09 am
The hexagonal restriction has turned me away from this contest. But for those who are interested, you can simply use the isometric map format and use hexagonal tiles, instead of using one of the libraries listed above.

Image: http://files.byondhome.com/CalusCoRPS/hexagonal_img.png

Demonstration: http://files.byondhome.com/CalusCoRPS/Hexagonal_src.zip
Jun 6 2011, 9:43 am
@Poplava
Yup, and in both cases, we get a much more interesting and richer experience for it when compared to traditional BYOND games.

I must disagree. Many - if not most - pixel-movement based games aren't nearly as fun as some of the games in original format. That's my only disagreement.

I actually like the idea of a hexagonal game.
Jun 6 2011, 3:56 pm
@Calus CoRPS:
Great resource! Thanks for sharing it. I recall folks talking about doing hex based maps with isometric but I haven't played around with isometric at all. Very nice.

I guess if you don't want to heavily modify core movement, location, and control systems, you can go with an isometric approach.

@Sum-Sum Productions: I suspect that many of the pixel based games are largely incomplete in comparison which may be the main issue. I would have invested a great deal on that front but alas, it was not meant to be.

Anyway, your right. That is just my personal take and I'll agree to disagree. ;)
Jun 7 2011, 1:47 am
Byond is designed for Isometric and Top Down. You managed to wreck a completely good competition. I would have joined to but can't be F***'d working with Hex's. I F***'n hate hex's.

Good luck and good riddens.
Jun 7 2011, 11:43 am (Edited on Jun 7 2011, 11:49 am)
@Kyle_zx

BYOND is designed for games. Not for any type of game. What's wrong with hex-based games?

@PopLava

The game has to be hexagon-based. This doesn't mean RTS/Puzzle, does it? I've got an idea that's.. really far from both.
Jun 7 2011, 12:18 pm
Sum-Sum Productions wrote:
BYOND is designed for games. Not for any type of game. What's wrong with hex-based games?

BYOND gives you a lot of stuff, like view() and get_step(), that assume you're using a square grid (no to mention, it provides you with the grid too). It'd take a non-trivial amount of work to deal with not being able to use these built-in features. Having a hex grid doesn't automatically make the game more fun, so it's a lot of work for essentially no benefit.
Jun 7 2011, 12:22 pm (Edited on Jun 7 2011, 12:28 pm)
@Forum_Account
Pixel movement is the same - it doesn't necessarily make the game more fun, but it allows a plethora of previously untouched possibilities.

@Poplava
I seem to be having trouble finding any games, Flash or otherwise, that utilize hexagons for anything other than aesthetics.
Take Hex Empire, for example. The same thing could have been done with a point-based or grid-based system, and made no difference.
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