EmpirezTeam wrote a very well thought out blog post a few days ago about his negative view on Valentine's Day. In short, one of his key points was that people trivialize holidays by simply going through the motions of the tradition.
I have long tried to crack the code of why some otherwise intelligent and analytical people are hamstrung when it comes fervent religious belief. Now, while I fully respect the peace it gives to people who celebrate their religion internally, it becomes ridiculous when it's presented in public.
So, I did a quick exercise with ET's example of Valentine's Day and realized how much his list translated to religion: Take references to "A gift" and replace with "Going to church", replace "someone" with "God", and replace "February 14" with "Sunday mornings". Change some stuff around to make sense and you get:
1. Going to church doesn't mean you love God. I can do dozens of things for God and smile in their face but on the inside I can hate that person or have ulterior motives behind doing it.
2. Not going to church doesn't mean the person doesn't love God. People at some point just started assuming that if didn't go to church, they're not a thoughtful or generous person and don't care about you. Which is stupidity.
3. If I really want to go to church, I can do that on any one of the other 6 days of the week. What is the difference between going to church on Tuesday at 3am as opposed to Sunday morning? Absolutely nothing. But the majority of people are bound by this custom. They already know that if they don't have some Valentine's Day cards and candy ready on February 14th every year, their relationship will be in jeopardy. So every year they faithfully bust their rear ends to find some sort of present or gift for their so-called lover because they are foolish morons bound by the idiotic customs of this world.
It seems to me that traditions are more for some sense of social belonging than it does for any actual reverence to God or, in ET's post, a relatively silly holiday. I spend a good two hours with my kids on Sunday to write Valentine's Day cards for their schoolmates -- not exactly with the loving intention of Saint Valentine, but more to prevent my kids from an easily avoidable awkward social situation. I would guess that many church-going folks go on Sunday morning because their absence would be noticed by their social circle.
Anyway, EmpirezTeam... That was wonderful food for thought. Keep up the good work.
Feb 15 2011, 7:26 am
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Toadfish
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We "go along" with many things that don't make sense. That's the definition of culture. Tradition /is/ for a sense of social belonging, but this isn't something you can criticise it about, I'd say.
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Pretty sure that dude was just trolling.
Either that or the goth kids in South Park were based on him personally. | |
There is nothing special to birthdays. They're a day like any other. Society is what makes them important. The question is, what's so bad about this?
Let's consider the more extreme view. Romance is so much trouble. We, human beings, who are always rational, don't need it. Give me one good reason my 'gifts', 'poetry' or 'flirting' mean anything. Let's create breeding facilities that trivialise the process of breeding. No need for all those meaningless gifts and talk about love. Give me one good, rational reason why romance, beyond the primitive partnership you might find in monkeys, is necessary, which doesn't validate feeling something special in Valentine's Day (I am not saying you need to feel something special, I am saying there is nothing wrong with). | |
Of course, there is one prime difference between going to church and Valentine's day. The latter is between two people. The former is between one person and God. This is why criticising someone for not going to church is much less justified, than a girl getting angry at her boyfriend for not spending Valentine's with her.
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Toadfish wrote:
There is nothing special to birthdays. They're a day like any other. Society is what makes them important. The question is, what's so bad about this? Let's consider the more extreme view. Romance is so much trouble. We, human beings, who are always rational, don't need it. Give me one good reason my 'gifts', 'poetry' or 'flirting' mean anything. Let's create breeding facilities that trivialise the process of breeding. No need for all those meaningless gifts and talk about love. Give me one good, rational reason why romance, beyond the primitive partnership you might find in monkeys, is necessary, which doesn't validate feeling something special in Valentine's Day (I am not saying you need to feel something special, I am saying there is nothing wrong with). I agree with your general premise, and it highlights one of my original points. The sense of "internal celebration" is what should be the reason for any holiday. The feelings you derive from any act of giving or receiving are by definition personal, and there is nothing bad about it. The way that I celebrated Valentine's Day with my wife would be considered by most to be completely ridiculous -- but we had fun for the most part. Hopefully, the tradition will add to the nostalgia of the day as it rolls around every year. However, the simple act of celebration does not need to be confined to a single day -- it's more a matter of convenience that one of those days happen to be February 14th. Oh, and to romance. There is a physiological addiction to dopamine (it's released like a shotgun when taking methamphetamines), and the lack of the anti-depression, OCD-inducing chemical seratonin that is addressed by love. So, in a literal way, yeah, human beings don't need it... but dang we are addicted to it. | |
I agree with you here. This kind of celebration is why I'm arguing holidays shouldn't be shunned for "not making sense".
Oh, and to romance. There is a physiological addiction to dopamine (it's released like a shotgun when taking methamphetamines), and the lack of the anti-depression, OCD-inducing chemical seratonin that is addressed by love. So, in a literal way, yeah, human beings don't need it... but dang we are addicted to it. That's pretty interesting--didn't know about it. How reasonable would it be to say that our addiction to romance goes in line with our liking for holiday celebrations, such as Valentine's, or Christmas Eve? Well, I suppose, even if it isn't, we are definitely addicted to celebrations in very much the same way. | |
My logic is too much for people like SAx. As you can see, he obviously doesn't have the ability to think this critically otherwise he would be able to offer more mature responses.
Instead, he just attacks me personally and calls me a troll without ever even trying to form an argument. But anyway: "There is nothing special to birthdays. They're a day like any other. Society is what makes them important. The question is, what's so bad about this?" What's bad is people are conditioned into believing that there IS something bad or wrong with you if you DON'T celebrate birthdays. I tell people all the time I don't celebrate Christmas and they look at me like I'm a lunatic. Then after I explain to them that I buy them gifts throughout the year because I think waiting until "December 25th" is unnecessary, they still look at me like I'm a lunatic. People are conditioned into believing they deserve something on their birthday. The fact is, we don't. But society teaches people that they do, and so when they don't receive something, they start making judgments on those people and conflict begins. | |
2DEEP4U
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SuperAntx wrote:
2DEEP4U Exactly. I'll dumb my posts down next time so that you can join in on the debate. I hadn't taken your stupidity into account as I was typing up the blog post and I apologize for that. | |
You're an angsty teenager with no life experience crying about not getting any gifts on Valentine's Day. Nothing you could ever possibly say would make me want to "debate" with you.
It would be like arguing with a toddler over which color is most purple. | |
SuperAntx wrote:
You're an angsty teenager with no life experience crying about not getting any gifts on Valentine's Day. Nothing you could ever possibly say would make me want to "debate" with you. As I said, all you do is attack me personally. I think you want to turn this into a name-calling contest to avoid the fact that you really can't argue against what I was saying and make sense. My age or me not getting anything on Valentine's Day has nothing to do with the discussion. Yet this is all you seem to be able to come up with. You're sad. | |
I already debunked your entire post with, "You're an angsty teenager with no life experience crying about not getting any gifts on Valentine's Day."
Everything henceforth is just pillow talk. | |
SuperAntx wrote:
I already debunked your entire post with, "You're an angsty teenager with no life experience crying about not getting any gifts on Valentine's Day." Lol, henceforth? Are you Tenkichi now? | |
I'll dumb my posts down next time so that you can understand it. I hadn't taken your stupidity into account as I was typing up the comment and I apologize for that.
ur a fegget | |
SuperAntx wrote:
I'll dumb my posts down next time so that you can understand it. I hadn't taken your stupidity into account as I was typing up the comment and I apologize for that. I think you're related to Tenkichi somehow. | |
ET has a Tenkichi fetish, clearly.
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PerfectGoku wrote:
ET has a Tenkichi fetish, clearly. He is the reason I came back to BYOND. | |
Case in check? No one cares.
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People who don't care don't comment.
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