I'm going to attempt to weigh the benefits of each system, and I would appreciate the help of anyone who reads this. Toss in ideas, benefits not listed, downsides, etc. at your leisure.
-Turn Based-
I've always seen turn-based combat systems more for thinkers, not that it's exclusive. It's for strategy, giving each side time to think about their next move, using their best possible tactics, items, and abilities to defeat their opponent by outsmarting or out maneuvering them.
By turn-based, I don't mean games like Dragon Warrior, Pokemon, or Final Fantasy. More like Final Fantasy Tactics, where mobility is allowed, so players can flank, back stab, and get to higher ground, but not the same system, just the concept.
Benefits of TB
+Both sides are given time to think, reducing some of the stress of acting RIGHT THEN
+Very versatile, abilities are less limited and easier to perform (sometimes, not always though, some can't be done in turn-based and still be as good)
+The game becomes less about how fast you can press the button, and more about what you're going to do next
Downsides of TB
-If not well-designed or at least easy to use, you could potentially lose interest in it. Also, being too slow or having turns with infinite time on each side can mean a player would get bored, or another player may go afk and leave the other stuck in combat.
-Some of the game's fast paced ability may be lost, since only one player will be acting at a time
-"Live"-
Live combat is for player's with reflexes, or who just like to get into combat to demonstrate their skill faster. Of course, skill isn't always used, but you understand what I mean.
Benefits of Live Combat
+Players are no longer limited by rounds and encounters
+The player gains more control over how their character handles combat, meaning that players can gain their own style in a way
+Seems to interest and hold interest better in some cases
+Gameplay moves much faster
Downsides of Live Combat
-Some players may find Live combat too fast to have a chance in
-Live combat can start to become about "Uber Builds" or "Uber Items", and then it's not fun anymore, thus making the only people who play munchkins
Just thinking about each one. Discuss if you will.
ID:152345
 Mar 6 2007, 9:52 am
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I mean that not everyone does though, and some people who make Uber Builds abuse their power over the weak. Which, is just how things work, and I guess in a way it even makes sense, but when it comes to games online, no one wants to denied their chance to go unhindered by people who have just played longer. It just isn't fun anymore. | |
When people complain about me being to strong I tell them to quit being a scrub and get some decent gear.
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Getting slightly away from combat designs here, but as far as the "Uber Build" topic goes:
I am extremely turned off by a game that has acceptable "Uber Builds", where you feel like you're "gimped" using any other build. Say you have a rogue class. Lets say your rogues have access to four abilities: Backstab, Dual Wield, Lay Trap, Stealth But the player can only choose two. Depending on how balanced your ability system is, lets say 80% of your rogue players specialize backstab and stealth. They all talk it up and tell everyone else how great it is and it becomes known as the rogue "uber build". Now lets say you, as a rogue player, decide you'd rather dual wield and lay traps. One day you've got a quest to go to a dungeon that requires a party. You announce that you're seeking a group, and some other player invites you to join. Upon seeing that you're not using the accepted "uber build", you are dubbed a "gimp" and rejected from the group. Those types of situations are very common in certain online RPGs (massive or not), and are very discouraging to me as a player. | |
You don't seem to get the point here. Some people prefer different abilities, for instance, not everybody likes the same thing as you. The uber builds stuff is lame.
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I don't mean this to be rude, but this is what I'm trying to avoid. Good gear will be available for every make and build, no abilities "Better" than the others, just your style of play.
But all of this focuses around the point of balance, which is essential. There are places for power gamers, but not uber builds. Not here at least. | |
I am confused...what game is this for and where is Enter the Wastes?
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Hehe, no, it's not for EtW. EtW is live.
I was just discussing the benefits of both, you don't know about the game yet :). EtW is still being developed, but since I started developing it, I noticed I got tired of working on one system so much. So, I started a side project. This actually helped me find some holes and things to add or improve in EtW, since I wasn't constantly looking at one approach. | |
What do you mean by "Live"?
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Oh okay, cool. I see.
Well, we cannot exactly explain which we like better because it depends what type of game it is, what it is about, what you can do in it, etc. Certain types of games should have specific fighting systems implemented. So, your question cannot really be answered. | |
Well, no turns basically. When you press forward, you move right then, when you click to attack, you attack. World of Warcraft, Elder Scrolls, any FPS, etc.
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I see your point. I'm sure there's still something you can say about one side or the other though. It's broad, so there's not really a limit. Just suggest whatever you think the benefits are, or could be for one side or the other, or both.
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Pakbaum wrote:
Well, no turns basically. When you press forward, you move right then, when you click to attack, you attack. World of Warcraft, Elder Scrolls, any FPS, etc. Actually, most MMORPGs like WOW give an illusion of a live combat system. But it's slightly different. Your auto attacks are basically turns. With your turn time based on your attack delay. And all your special attacks are on re-use timers... I'm not sure what you'd call it, but I think of it more as a mix between the two. | |
I prefer live most of the time, but I also would prefer turn-based on strategy games and certain RPGs. I have no idea what this game is about so I cannot exactly tell you which I would prefer. I do not even know what genre it is. Also, I cannot exactly give you examples of why I would want live/turn-based or not want live/turn-based in your game because I know nothing about it, so giving reasons would make no sense...nor do I have reasons to give since no information was given out about this game. Do you see what I mean? =P
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FINALLY! Someone who uses Byond that's going for this kind of game, I mean, I'd really like Failed Fate 0 to have it, but w/e, I do like how Dalze made a paper dolling system though.
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I'll share with you what I'm doing in my game. Combat is going to be ages away (still working on the basic NPC and communications systems), but I've tossed around the ideas a bit.
The movement system will lead to a system similar to a turn based strategy RPG (Disgaea, FFT, etc). However, the regeneration of movement points over a time interval will eliminate the need for a "turn" system, and easily allow multiple players to act simultaneously. I haven't finalized the notes for attacking, but it'll follow largely the same concept as moving.
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Alright. Archaic times, RPG, skill-based, RP encouraged (not forced). That's the general idea.
I won't say anything more other than that mobs the players fight will each be difficult and different. Players in this game will not be equipped to fight every battle just because they have a sword and armor. Demons have very exotic ways of defeating (One demon example is the Mirror Demon, who must be found using a mirror, and then trapped within it. You'll just have to wait to see how you'll do that :) ). Undead will be one of the few enemies fought in mass numbers, and will be difficult to kill, but players will find the means to kill them less challenging than some. (Example: Zombies will always revive unless completely destroyed, but they can be immobilized with enough damage. Vampires must be burned, stakes immobilize them, but only certain wood.). Some rare enemies are nearly un-killable, save one means of killing them, and very few enemies will be killable through brute force alone, but fighter-types will still be highly usefull, since the enemies that must be killed through damage alone will be very tough anyways. Some enemies cannot be killed at all, and may only be delayed. That's all for now :) | |
I disagree, I enjoy making "Uber builds".