Mode 7 Engine

ID:152143
 
Dec 26 2007, 7:32 am
I've been studying different mode 7 engines for different programs(Such as Flash 9, C++, even a ti-83[If a working "Mode 7" program works for a ti-83, I think it'll work for BYOND]). And thinking it could work for byond, if you had a low enough resolution on it(which I will show the example of in a second).

Well what you could do is use trigonometry to make it, or just simply have a constant rendering process(which would make BYOND lag more.).

Here is an example of how the strip lines of each tile would be stretched out in-game for it to actually work, and look good enough, and still look 3D.




Having 30 lines total, and goes from 1-13(In line length). This will have it as a low resolution, and still look 3d for the game to run fast and look good.


And if this "Mode 7" engine actually does work, DanTom could intergrate it into byond as a "Mode 7" program itself, so we could make racing games, or whatever you would need this for.

Now you may say its impossible, and byond cant handle 3d, though look at Vengence 56, its a 2.5D Ray Tracing game, that can run good if at low resolutions. So im saying this could be the same.
Dec 26 2007, 8:54 am
Bakasensei wrote:
I've been studying different mode 7 engines for different programs(Such as Flash 9, C++, even a ti-83[If a working "Mode 7" program works for a ti-83, I think it'll work for BYOND]). And thinking it could work for byond, if you had a low enough resolution on it(which I will show the example of in a second).

Well what you could do is use trigonometry to make it, or just simply have a constant rendering process(which would make BYOND lag more.).

This has been done in BYOND. The problem is, it has never been done, and can never be done, very well. BYOND has limited support for dynamic icons and will simply eventually run out of space in its cache file. You'd literally have to--and by that I mean I'd literally have to--built some sort of support for this into the engine itself.

Comparing this to a TI-83 is apples and oranges. The hardware and software is very different, and drawing can be done directly there whereas in BYOND, everything is icon-based.

Also, you really need to stop calling these "mode 7 engines" and instead call them perspective rendering or some such. "Mode 7" in this context is a term that has meaning nowhere outside of the Super Nintendo.

Now you may say its impossible, and byond cant handle 3d, though look at Vengence 56, its a 2.5D Ray Tracing game, that can run good if at low resolutions. So im saying this could be the same.

Vengeance 56 is more of a proof of concept than anything else. Gakumerasara likes to stretch the BYOND engine--which is a good thing, since that's how I got started myself. But no BYOND game is capable of sustaining any semblance of 3D indefinitely. BYOND is, truly, not capable of first-person shooters in any realistic sense.

Lummox JR
Dec 26 2007, 10:32 am
In response to Lummox JR
Well I was just using mode 7 as my reference, and it can be done, it just, as you said wont be done well. And whats getting me mad is the negative attitude towards it, it would, if nothing just be cool to play around with, such as Gaku has really made vengence 56(Since it cant really be a fun fast paced game). And if nothing atleast mimick what its trying to do, by making your own icons for turns and straight-aways to mimick its possibilities(Like the Maze 3D's have done).

And I was using the ti-83 as an example because byond has more potential for stuff like this than that does, and the engine for it works perfectly

I would just really love to see this on byond, that is all, not even stretching all of its possibilities.
Dec 26 2007, 11:01 am
In response to Bakasensei
Bakasensei wrote:
Well I was just using mode 7 as my reference, and it can be done, it just, as you said wont be done well.

You're missing the point; it can't be done. You can create a perspective view of something by creating the requisite icons, and you can do this a few times, though not quickly. You cannot, however, do this indefinitely as a game reasonably demands. Your game would never run quickly and it would be destined to crash. Your vision of a Mario Kart game is certainly nowhere near achievable.

And whats getting me mad is the negative attitude towards it, it would, if nothing just be cool to play around with, such as Gaku has really made vengence 56(Since it cant really be a fun fast paced game). And if nothing atleast mimick what its trying to do, by making your own icons for turns and straight-aways to mimick its possibilities(Like the Maze 3D's have done).

Most of the 3D mazes have used a lot of static images to build what you see, which helps because BYOND can't dynamically create icons ad infinitum. They're basically mock-3D, not real 3D.

And I was using the ti-83 as an example because byond has more potential for stuff like this than that does, and the engine for it works perfectly

BYOND has more gaming potential overall, yes. But it does not draw directly to the screen nor have a built-in perspective renderer, without either of which this is functionally impossible.

Lummox JR
Dec 26 2007, 12:44 pm
One option would be to prerender all of the icons, save 'em, and package them with the game. That's about as efficient as you will get it. I imagine it'd take a long time, though--it really depends on how the engine is. If the screen turns every time the vehicle turns, then it will take a very long time and the resource would be very large. If this is just a drag racing game, then it'd be pretty damn good.
Dec 26 2007, 9:16 pm
In response to CaptFalcon33035
Yes I was thinking that too(really not having a turning screen) just have the course, and have some turns, and straightaways really. Lummonox was taking it too far, thinking doing the real full program(Though that would be cool).