The skill to use overwatch ults is timing. If u have bad timing then more than likely your screwed. If not then you get good success ;).
Except bastions ult need no timing or skill for that shit.
Correct, an ability like that on a hero that does relatively little outside of that considering any team that isn't stupid is going to dedicate an Offensive hero to shutting her down. Unlike Dota 2 where you pick 5 heroes and you're stuck with them the entire game, I can go from a hero that struggles against Widowmaker to a hero that makes her life a living hell in a matter of seconds.
You're saying Overwatch requires no skill because a hero that's: - Hard to get kills with - Easy to spot - Easy to counter - Heavily reliant on teammates Happens to have an ultimate that makes up for it the exact same way AM would be utterly abysmal to play as if he couldn't Blink. Not only this, just because she pops her ultimate doesn't mean she gets to benefit from it. Similar to how sometimes you can go Reinhardt and stand in front as a shield and your teammates don't take advantage of it and start from behind you, sometimes you pop Widowmaker ultimate and your teammates still aren't able to push onto a point and capture it. The fact of the matter is, Widowmaker still has to be a good Widowmaker with decent teammates to pull everything off. Her ultimate isn't all that game changing, especially when as you said, a lot of heroes in Overwatch have similar high impact abilities, which contradicts your statement, since if multiple heroes can press one button as you say and just "enable easy mode", then all someone has to do is press their "easy mode" button after Widowmaker uses hers and the teams are back on equal footing. So for example, when multiple enemies are clumped up, Pharah and Hanzo can easily kill them all with an ultimate. You're right, doesn't take much skill. However, the enemy team can run Mercy and press "easy mode revive" and now that Hanzo/Pharah ult is essentially negated which also didn't require much skill. And again, we're mainly talking about ultimates here. ULTIMATES. The very thing you're complaining about is what they're SUPPOSED to do. How mechanically difficult was it for Universe to pull off his $6 million Echo Slam? Let's watch. Ok, so he had to press his Blink Dagger hotkey, click anywhere inside the Rosh pit, press R, press W, press Q. In fact, half of what Universe did wasn't even necessary. That Rosh attempt was over with the moment he Echo'd, there was no way they were going to be able to continue with that with the rest of EG running in. So we can conclude that pressing 2 buttons and a single mouse click secured the victory of a game with $6 million on the line. Even I could've made that play and I'm not a professional Dota 2 player. Once again, Overwatch is simpler, but not for the reasons you're coming up with. | |
$6,000,000 Echo Slam You missed the Ice Vortex for 30% magic resist reduction. Then the Ice Blast for 350 damage + 180 more over time + preventing any healing which might I add got 2 of the 4 kills in that fight while prevented any king of retaliation. It's not like he pressed 1 button and got 5 kills. But I'll say it again. You're missing the point. The point I am making and I believe I have said several times is that abilities in Overwatch remove or lessen the need for player skill. You do not need to do things yourself, or get good at doing certain things because these abilities act as a crutch and do it for you. They are essentially like Flash in LoL. You don't need to learn the layout of the map or where enemies will go because you can see the enemies anyway if your team has Hanzo or Widowmaker. You don't need to learn to rocket jump because you have a button to do it automatically as Pharah. You don't need to learn to aim because half the abilities in the game automatically aim for you. I could go on and on. In DotA 2 if I am Antimage, I still need map awareness because even though I have blink I can still be killed. If Blink triggered automatically when an enemy got near Antimage and always blinked him to the safest point he could be at, then it'd be more comparable. | |
They're not missing your point, Magic. They just disagree and have been stating their case against yours. You just aren't listening to them. You don't have to agree with them but don't act like they're not listening to you.
This whole debate is silly, though. | |
The Magic Man wrote:
$6,000,000 Echo Slam I didn't miss it. This is precisely why I said he didn't have to really do anything outside of ulting. He had won the team fight just by pressing R after blinking in. But I'll say it again. You're missing the point. The point I am making and I believe I have said several times is that abilities in Overwatch remove or lessen the need for player skill. You do not need to do things yourself, or get good at doing certain things because these abilities act as a crutch and do it for you. They are essentially like Flash in LoL. I love it when I hear Dota 2 players say that. "LEAGUE IS EASIER BECAUSE EVERYONE GETS A FLASH". This is not the reason League is easier and is actually a highly necessary summoner spell considering the way they went about designing items. You could've listed a bunch of other stuff, like the lack of loss of gold upon death, instead of Flash, but saying that tells me you have a poor understanding of how League works. You don't need to learn the layout of the map or where enemies will go because you can see the enemies anyway if your team has Hanzo or Widowmaker. For 15 seconds in the case of Widowmaker, and in a small AoE in the spot Hanzo aimed at. These mechanics are also necessary since 60 minute matches are not what Overwatch is intended for. In order to speed things along, you're going to need ultimates that, you know... end games. You don't need to learn to rocket jump because you have a button to do it automatically as Pharah. Yes, Pharah's design would be much better if 50% of her game play consisted of her firing at the ground directly beneath her as opposed to at enemies. Also, there is a such thing as animation cancelling in the game, and is a mechanic you have to teach yourself how to do because the game itself never makes mention of it. You don't need to learn to aim because half the abilities in the game automatically aim for you. Except Soldier 76 dies in like 3 hits from most heroes, which is why he's given a Sprint and a AoE heal so he can at least have SOME chance at survival. But I guess a glass cannon Offense hero having an ultimate that lets him do more damage is bad game design. In DotA 2 if I am Antimage, I still need map awareness because even though I have blink I can still be killed. If Blink triggered automatically when an enemy got near Antimage and always blinked him to the safest point he could be at, then it'd be more comparable. You mean like how Abaddon automatically turns incoming damage into healing without having to do anything? SUCH SKILL IS REQUIRED. LETS READ THE DESCRIPTION SHALL WE: When activated, all damage dealt to you will heal instead of harm. Most negative buffs will also be removed. If the ability is not on cooldown, it will automatically activate if your health falls below 400. | |
Kumorii wrote:
They're not missing your point, Magic. They just disagree and have been stating their case against yours. You just aren't listening to them. You don't have to agree with them but don't act like they're not listening to you. | |
Kumorii wrote:
This whole debate is silly, though. We're just having our bi-monthly "why the game I like is better than the game you like" discussion. This is why I titled it "The correct opinion of Overwatch". That was done specifically to trigger the only two people on the site who play these games as much as I do: TMM and Rushbutt. | |
I play Overwatch and have fun. I'm just not sure how competitive play is going to work.
EmpirezTeam is correct, everything can be beaten. Everyone has a counter. Although, I do wish it didn't have all these lock-on abilities. I feel like a competitive game shouldn't have lock on abilities. Then again, League does too so- | |
PC.
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Dota 2 has lock on abilities too. There are also abilities that don't require you to click on someone or aim. You just press a button and the ability homes in the nearest targets for you. Necrolyte, Tinker and Skywrath Mage are all examples of this.
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Yeah, sure. I have things to do atm though. Lavenblade#1972
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;)
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I'm on NA. :P
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Lavenblade wrote:
I'm on NA. :P In the process of resetting the shit out of my pc. >.< Has been rebooting like an ass for weeks now and i just replaced the memory and the internal temp was only 30 degrees c, and since it hasnt shut off at all while resetting im willing to say a driver is anal whipping it. :] so i can't play today :C. Im gonna have to redoawnload all my apps and | |
Reformat that shit, lol. If the issue still persists, perhaps it's a hardware issue.
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Abaddons ult doesn't activate on a killing blow. This means Iceblast and Culling Blade can both bypass it entirely. So can any source of damage that does enough damage to simply kill him. You can also prevent the passive part of it from triggering automatically with Doom (doom will also silence to prevent it from being manually used), Demonic Purge (with aghs for both) or Silver Edge.
Also, Widowmaker is actually so broken she is getting a nerf. So is Mcree because autoaim instant kills are tip top balanced. | |
Wait why is widow maker getting a nerf? Hanzo is the one who needs nerft.
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Her ultimate removes the need for an otherwise necessary skill that players should possess. For her entire team.
In DotA 2, most abilities do not replace the need for player skill, infact in most cases player skill is needed to use them effectively (and some of them, when used poorly can cause more harm than good). Widowmakers ult is press a button to enable easy mode.
Overwatch has many abilities like this, many of them require no skill and infact remove or lessen the need for player skill.