Sep 22 2015, 2:56 am
In response to Ter13
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Lummox JR
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I'm a firm compatibilisit. I believe in hard determinism and free will both. It's actually a bit of a minor theme in one of my books.
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You are talking about all those pegs crammed through the holes.
Not every one of them makes it through and don't ever try to deny someones individuality, because although their disgusting society may attempt to form them all into the same cog they are drastically different when you count the teeth. :) This is just another one of those cases of where we are saying the same things but differently worded. Another case where you don't need to scalpel my post just to make yourself seem "more right than me". It isn't a competition, they may have you think it is one, but it isn't and I am not competing. | |
...I was disagreeing with something you said and sharing my perspective on philosophy. But if that's offensive... I uh... Don't particularly feel like talking about kittens and reality TV, so that's a no-go. People can have different opinions and neither one has to be right, guy. It's not about who is right. It's about making a strong case for what you believe without resorting to irrationality. And challenging someone else's view isn't always about winning the argument. It's about testing your argument against theirs, abandoning what doesn't make sense, refining your approach and information, and gaining new insight from others. I wouldn't talk to you at all if I didn't respect you a little bit. Of course, that's just like, my perspective, man.
Lummox JR wrote: I'm a firm compatibilisit. I think compatibilism can't be ruled out. I'm fundamentally "agnostic" if you'll excuse the phrase, but I really do see free will used to justify all kinds of atrocity and bigotry. It's a major social problem. At best, I think we're deluding ourselves to the power of free will, at worse, I think we're deluding ourselves to the existence of free will. I've been stuck in this Nietzsche-sized hole for the last two years, though. Haven't worked my way out of that particular zone of philosophy yet, but I know I'm really uncomfortable with Nietzschean Ethics even though I can find no good reason to reject them. | |
Well I don't mean to make it an argument (and trust me, I may have kittens but I do not talk about them and reality TV).
Anyway, I just felt it as kind of you were attempting to disprove human choice, which is clearly a direct correlation with how someones life unfolds (given their circumstances, yes society holds us all down, yes society is a toxic scourge upon the earth that has ruined all of life, yes society ruins peoples potential in pursuit of meaningless nonsense like corporate profits, etc) but think about simple choices people make. Should I speak to that person or ignore them? Should I get on the highway or stay on the off roads? Etc... my only point was that little decisions can indeed have a big impact on how someones life turns out. Choices really do matter and are not just some irrelevant after thought. Should I save that person from that burning car? Nah, let em burn. Should I ...etc Choices do make the most impact. Think of it just like a MUD with paths branching off from each decision. That is exactly how life is except in life the decisions are generally permanent and can have catastrophic after affects with almost no foresight whatsoever. In a book, they build a lot of foresight through fore-shadowing what is about to happen and life does this to an extent too (bad feelings/intuition/etc) but not to the point that, without having a personal experience to learn from, that one can avoid all the bad choices (can't be done otherwise one becomes one of the folks who never learns anything because they are too afraid to fail or take chances and thus faints at the first sight of blood because they never skinned a knee! Or whatever). I wasn't really trying to be philosophical or turn this thread into such a discussion; I was just wonderizing (new word!) over the impacts our little choices have on our lives (mostly unrealized by many). As they say, that bucket will eventually fill up with just one repeating drop of water (no choice is too small or has no impact). | |
DarkCampainger wrote:
Looks like things are quieting down during the weekdays. Some of us are women of science. | |
Oddly enough Ter said we don't have free choice and in the exact same post they said that we do but did so in a manner trying to suggest free choice isn't a thing.
Person chooses A. Person can be persuaded to instead choose B. Since Person may at any time switch between choosing A or B, their choice is unrestricted and thus free. Still really stupid thing to worry about though. Doesn't do anything for anyone. | |
I think the real question here is if reality even exists at all..
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With the world as stupid and messed up as it is, I tend to lean towards it not being as real as we all like to think it is. :)
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I bought some membership.
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Cause: "Jimmy was walking around in a construction site. A steel beam was hovering above his head as he passed by. Suddenly, it fell on to his head."
Effect: "Jimmy is dead." What killed Jimmy? Cause: "Jimmy was walking down the street casually when a dog (pit bull) jumps over the fence. The dog chases after Jimmy and Jimmy runs." Effect: "Sooner or later, Jimmy is caught and the dog attacks him. Jimmy is now hospitalized." What hospitalized Jimmy? Here's a tough one... Cause: "Jimmy boards a plane and heads to a foreign country. Suddenly, the engine blows and the plane is sent flying in to the desert." Effect: "The pilot wasn't doing enough cocaine and alcohol so he couldn't land the plane all cool and stuff. As such, the plane crashed; it was torn in two killing all passengers, including the pilots, except for Jimmy." What caused everyone to die except for Jimmy? | |
AERProductions wrote:
The answer is always the NSA now. Well, that sums up everything with this conversation. Thank you for your time. | |
Ghost of ET wrote:
DarkCampainger wrote: And what of the children of science? Would you deny poor little Jimmy? Dexter? | |
Huh. Only $36 and I'm number eight.
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A little bit late on my part, but match donated! I'm sorry for slacking; men, women, and chil'ns of science! (I didn't mean to leave anyone out; so poor little Jimmy,
I was distracted by the amazing GIAD 2015 (which you should totally check out/participate in if you haven't already). Thanks to everyone who donated in the past couple of days, we're now over $3000! We've still got a little ways to go, so if you have any friends who sit on BYOND all day but have never donated, give 'em gentle prod and see if they would be willing to part with a few dollars to support the site and software! (or if that's you, consider this your prodding!)  | |
Last call folks! If you want your donation matched, make sure to get it in before midnight PST (see the event timer in the original post for what that is in your local time zone). However, if you want it matched this month, you'll want to get it in within the next 3 hours. If you donate after then, but before midnight, I probably won't be able to match it until tomorrow morning.
Thanks to everyone who has donated so far! We may not hit the whole goal, but at least we gave Lummox JR a small bonus this month (lord knows he deserves more for the cool stuff he's added recently!) | |
You guys should have started it on the 1st of the month, since a lot of people get paid then. :P
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DarkCampainger wrote:
That means it's time for another Unofficial This fundraiser was out of the goodness of DC's hole in his chest. I guess I agree that if he had held it earlier, more people may have been able to donate. /shrug | |
Well, also keep in mind that the earlier I start, the more money I have to set aside for the matches. There is a practical limit to how much I can donate--one that involves how much instant ramen I'm willing to eat =)
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Regardless, you did very good things for BYOND with this fundraiser. Thank you. :3
By no means was I complaining. I hope I didn't offend anyone. | |