There appears to be some confusion here about the BYONDime fiasco. I will attempt to clarify a bit.

BDs have never been profitable for us. This move will actually reduce our expenses. So all comments about the end of BD being the end of BYOND are naive and uninformed. BYOND is not going anywhere.

The financial cost of maintaining the BD commerce has never been a big deal. We looked at it as an investment-- with enough users this could be a profitable venture. However, we did not anticipate the hassle associated with the system, not even close. If it were a perfect world and everyone simply abided by some common-sense ethics, there wouldn't have been a problem. Instead, we were bombarded with frauds, theft, and complaints. We simply don't have the manpower to deal with this; perhaps one day we will.

More importantly, I don't like what the BD system has done to BYOND. Some people comment, "I won't use BYOND if it can't make money for me." Well, I don't want those people around. Money should not be the impetus here; it should be an afterthought. But BDs have turned our site-- formerly a place place for amateurs to learn to program and have some fun-- into a mini e-bay, scams and all. We've got 12 year olds selling stolen icons so they can get money to become "GMs" in games built on stolen code. No thanks!

That said, these changes do not mark the complete destruction of the commerce system. As I mentioned before, we will be providing some mechanisms for certain users to sell their subscriptions through PayPal or other services. We may give this away freely, or require a small merchant fee to weed out the scammers. And users are always welcome to sell their wares on their own and manually activate subscriptions-- anyone can do this right now.

As far as the BYOND business model goes, you users need not worry. We will be making some little changes in the next major release to allow users to donate to our project, but the basic software (client, server, and compiler) will always be free. Our goal is to recoup our monthly server expenses, or at least a signficant percentage, through a shareware fee-- anything extra is just icing on the cake. That will allow us to expand our audience and one day be a well-known entity on the Internet. That's far more valuable to me personally than any sort of financial rewards.

Tom wrote:

There appears to be some confusion here about the BYONDime fiasco. I will attempt to clarify a bit.

BDs have never been profitable for us. This move will actually reduce our expenses. So all comments about the end of BD being the end of BYOND are naive and uninformed. BYOND is not going anywhere.

The financial cost of maintaining the BD commerce has never been a big deal. We looked at it as an investment-- with enough users this could be a profitable venture. However, we did not anticipate the hassle associated with the system, not even close. If it were a perfect world and everyone simply abided by some common-sense ethics, there wouldn't have been a problem. Instead, we were bombarded with frauds, theft, and complaints. We simply don't have the manpower to deal with this; perhaps one day we will.

More importantly, I don't like what the BD system has done to BYOND. Some people comment, "I won't use BYOND if it can't make money for me." Well, I don't want those people around. Money should not be the impetus here; it should be an afterthought. But BDs have turned our site-- formerly a place place for amateurs to learn to program and have some fun-- into a mini e-bay, scams and all. We've got 12 year olds selling stolen icons so they can get money to become "GMs" in games built on stolen code. No thanks!

That said, these changes do not mark the complete destruction of the commerce system. As I mentioned before, we will be providing some mechanisms for certain users to sell their subscriptions through PayPal or other services. We may give this away freely, or require a small merchant fee to weed out the scammers. And users are always welcome to sell their wares on their own and manually activate subscriptions-- anyone can do this right now.

As far as the BYOND business model goes, you users need not worry. We will be making some little changes in the next major release to allow users to donate to our project, but the basic software (client, server, and compiler) will always be free. Our goal is to recoup our monthly server expenses, or at least a signficant percentage, through a shareware fee-- anything extra is just icing on the cake. That will allow us to expand our audience and one day be a well-known entity on the Internet. That's far more valuable to me personally than any sort of financial rewards.

I never really looked at it from that prospective, but it does make a lot of sense. It will surely scout out the scammers and keep the people with common-sense.


RaeKwon

We love u tom. LoL

I think you misunderstood what I meant. I currently have credit cards and could easily get more. The point was that here perants arent as open too using their credit cards to buy kids things on the internet.
Also I know heaps of 18+ people who dont have credit cards. They seem to be major things in America but havent taken off everywhere else.
Most of the older people I know think of them as debt traps so they avoid them.

And thats the way it should be.. I'm pretty much living off a cashless system these days. The only time I deal with cash is for things like food at the drive-thru. Otherwise cash is just just a hassle, only checks I write are for the rent.

LJR

PayByCash is illegal to use for people under 18 because you have to sign a contact, did you not read the FAQ?

I think PayPal is a wise option. For us UKers over here, we can use either Credit cards or Switch or Solo cards. Americans, or anyone else in other countries can use credit cards such as Visa, Mastercard, Discover etc.

Worldpay is also an option, I believe, but it is a little expensive.

While I concede that British people won't have any problems (thanks to Solo et al.), I as a resident of Germany am not able to use PayPal without a credit card.

This won't be a major problem, though, since continental European non-credit card users probably make only a small amount of the BYOND community, but I won't be able to make donations to certain games that way - something I can do with dimes I earn through donations myself or otherwise.

splatty

I havn't read all the posts in this thread, but did anyone ask what is going to happen to subscriptions, etc.?

I know in America at least, a debit card (which can be gotten from whatever bank you use) can be used in place of a credit card provided it's the same 'brand' as an accepted credit card at the business. For example, a Visa or MasterCard debit card works like a Visa or MasterCard credit card, except it's charged to your checking account rather than a bill with interest in your mailbox. It usually takes a few days for the money to go out, but it happens. I don't see any reason why this wouldn't hold true in Europe as well.

I know for a fact debit cards can be accepted like credit cards because I bought a registered version of a shareware program online with one. The registration requested a credit card and my debit card worked because it was the same brand as one of the accepted credit cards.